Rubin2020_PCW slack archives day3-wed-slot1a-plenary-scicollabs 2020-07-15---2020-08-13

Wed 2020-07-15 03:02PM
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Melissa Graham Wed 2020-08-05 02:56PM
@Melissa Graham set the channel topic: Plenary 3 - Science Collaborations Report
Chair: Federica Bianco
Webpage with agenda and links: <>
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-05 10:28PM
Hello @here , this is a space for the Science Collaboration plenary of the Rubin PCW - we will collect questions for the SC chairs, spokespersons, and representatives on this channel leading up and during the SC plenary, ask away! I am the Science Collaborations Coordinator and the SC chairs, and cohosts of this session, are @Rstreet and @Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) - TVS; @rmandelb and @Pat Burchat - DESC; @Meg Schwamb and @David Trilling - SSSC; @Sugata Kaviraj and @Manda Banerji - Galaxies SC; @Aprajita Verma and @Timo Anguita - SLSC; @Peregrine @Will Clarkson and @jgizis - SMWLV SC; @Tom Loredo and @Chad Schafer (he/him) - ISSC; @William Nielsen Brandt - AGN SC
Ranpal (she/her/hers) Tue 2020-08-11 06:01PM
Session:_Plenary 3 - Science Collaborations Report
Date/time: Wednesday August 12, 2020 - 06:00 HST - 09:00 PT - 12:00 EDT - 18:00 CEST - 02:00 AET +1
Passcode: 257500
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 11:50AM
Hi @channel ! during today's plenary on the SCs please ask Sc related questions here, or on the zoom Q/A - we will answer live as many as we can, and we will answer the rest of them on this slack after the session
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 12:22PM
Now is a good time to ask DESC and TVS questions!
Chuck Claver Wed 2020-08-12 12:23PM
Q: Does TVSSC cover light echos?
Knut Olsen Wed 2020-08-12 12:25PM
There is interest in light echoes in SMWLV, probably also in TVS
Chuck Claver Wed 2020-08-12 12:26PM
@Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Gracias :pray:
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 12:27PM
and I would love to talk about it more!
Chris Walter Wed 2020-08-12 12:33PM
I would love to hear a pedagogical talk about the science of this some time!
Reil Wed 2020-08-12 12:25PM
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 12:28PM
Now is a good time to ask AGN and Strong Lensing (SL) questions!
Andy Ptak Wed 2020-08-12 12:31PM
Will the data challenges that Niel referred to be based on existing optical data or also use simulated Rubin data?
Franz Bauer Wed 2020-08-12 12:46PM
Hi Andy. At the moment, we are envisioning that this will be done using existing data in some form, so there is some degree of ground truth, but likely blinded in a way so that one cannot "game" the challenge; obviously we want/need image depth and ideally some variability info to match LSST. It is still in an early stage of development...we suspect we will issue it in 2021.
Andy Ptak Wed 2020-08-12 12:50PM
Thanks, Franz.
William Nielsen Brandt Wed 2020-08-12 12:52PM
Franz has largely answered. We chose XMM-LSS and COSMOS because they have near-LSST-like data (in some respects) from HSC. Also, we wanted to work with real data in real fields since bringing in multiwavelength data is so essential for AGN work. All this being said, we do have interest in looking at simulations separately.
wvanreeven Wed 2020-08-12 12:31PM
Will other fields of lensing be covered as well, like micro lensing by moving stars toward the LMC?
Timo Anguita Wed 2020-08-12 12:55PM
(answer to the question below that applies here as well): I got cut off to answer this live. But due to the nature of the SLSC being a collaboration focused on a method rather than a specific science goal, there is bound to be significant cross-collaboration with most if not all SCs. We thus encourage all of you working in any science case "using" strong lensing (which includes microlensing) to reach out to us and join our SC.
Jay Strader Wed 2020-08-12 12:32PM
there is a subgroup of TVS focused on microlensing
Will Clarkson Wed 2020-08-12 12:34PM
SMWLV and DESC are also interested in microlensing (DESC I think more at the long-timescale end)
Rstreet Wed 2020-08-12 12:35PM
This was one of the motivations for joining with SL for a joint workshop, based on the proposal lead by Aprajita. Another good reason to foster inter-SC connections! Sounds like we should reach out more to the other SCs.
Will Clarkson Wed 2020-08-12 12:36PM
I think TVS' formation of the dedicated subgroup that Jay mentions has been really effective in making progress.
Timo Anguita Wed 2020-08-12 12:39PM
I got cut off to answer this live. But due to the nature of the SLSC being a collaboration focused on a method rather than a specific science goal, there is bound to be significant cross-collaboration with most if not all SCs. We thus encourage all of you working in any science case "using" strong lensing (which includes microlensing) to reach out to us and join our SC.
rmandelb Wed 2020-08-12 12:46PM
SMWLV and DESC are also interested in microlensing Right - as mentioned in the DESC talk, we're interested in fundamental cosmological physics - dark energy, dark matter, ... and the microlensing interest is primarily associated with our relatively new (as of about a year ago) dark matter working group. :slightly_smiling_face:
Robert Lupton Wed 2020-08-12 12:33PM
The project is committed to difference imaging in all fields, even those where crowding dominates (Sag!) where direct imaging is officially best-effort.
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 12:43PM
please continue asking questions - even if we do not get to them during the live event we will answer them all here
Hiranya Peiris Wed 2020-08-12 12:44PM
Can these great slides be made available on the agenda page?
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 12:45PM
yes! apologies if they are not already - i will put them up right after the talk
Tom J Wilson Wed 2020-08-12 12:46PM
Slightly personally biased and leading question: how can we work with the observatory to ensure that - especially in crowded fields but more generally in all fields, across stars AND galaxies - that quoted parameters e.g. uncertainties are as "right" as possible?
Will Clarkson Wed 2020-08-12 12:48PM
Sorry, Tom - I'll try to make sure this gets answered in the general Q&A at the end of the session, otherwise we can discuss in detail in this thread.
Tom J Wilson Wed 2020-08-12 12:49PM
No problem, I think this is probably too broad a question to get a single answer in the Q&A, I just wanted to raise the thought more than anything
Will Clarkson Wed 2020-08-12 12:54PM
But yes this is extremely important to a lot of (not just!) SMWLV science.
Will Clarkson Wed 2020-08-12 01:02PM
To start the ball rolling on the discussion... can you say a bit more about what you mean by parameters being as "right" as possible? E.g. are you asking about determination and propagation of believable uncertainties, or of the selection of pre-existing deep and precise catalogs for calibration fields?
Tom J Wilson Wed 2020-08-12 01:04PM
I mostly cared about the determination of uncertainties - for example, a sample of N sources with the same astrometric uncertainty, should have a distribution of separations to Gaia objects that has that same sigma - i.e., quoted and believed uncertainties should reflect statistical scatter or standard deviations of ensemble sets of data with those quoted uncertainties
Will Clarkson Wed 2020-08-12 01:10PM
Gotcha - I think that overlaps a lot with the ISSC science collaboration and possibly also the DM team... this I think would be a great conversation for a community thread on this (for wider readership), have you made contact with the ISSC science collaboration at this point?
Will Clarkson Wed 2020-08-12 01:11PM
e.g. I think this would be a great question for the Community ISSC Q&A Community thread that KT mentions a few messages below.
Tom J Wilson Wed 2020-08-12 01:24PM
I definitely plan to follow up with the ISSC (which I think was mentioned in the Q&A just after I posted my leading question!), so will move this over there for starters I guess - I think it's a key area where the ISSC and basically all SCs (although perhaps some more than others; like the SMWLV and its edge cases of high levels of crowding) could benefit from interactions
Chuck Claver Wed 2020-08-12 12:49PM
Q: For SSSC and perhaps ISSC: Is there any solar system science that can be gained from the analysis of meteor trail statistics in the LSST data?
Chuck Claver Wed 2020-08-12 12:57PM
@David Trilling Thanks - I would be interested n further conversation on this topic. I also am wondering what commissioning observations might be useful.
Lynne Jones Wed 2020-08-12 01:04PM
(to pull in from conversation further down in the main channel) The satellite trails will be masked or mitigated as much as possible; what impact will this have on work that would find meteor trails useful?
Lynne Jones Wed 2020-08-12 01:05PM
I am not entirely sure how much meteor trail science would be done with LSST - typically this is done with all-sky cameras. However, LSST does have an unsually large field of view .. it's just not as large as all-sky.
Lynne Jones Wed 2020-08-12 01:07PM
I don't know how the patchiness of the LSST pointings (a small part of the sky at varying times) would translate to constraints on meteors.
Presumably, the work that mitigates the satellite trails will mark them as such (i.e. the mask layer in the images might have a particular flag for 'very long streak'). Maybe even if the trails were masked in this way, you could still pull something out?
Meg Schwamb Wed 2020-08-12 01:11PM
in terms of science priorities in the SSSC- no one mentioned meteorite trails in our science roadmap writing. I think meteor trails are better in wide field fish eyes where you get the full track on the sky.
Meg Schwamb Wed 2020-08-12 01:12PM
Science roadmap -->
Michele Bannister Thu 2020-08-13 04:38AM
I also don't know if the meteor community aren't used to having such wide-field deep imagers available! Good point, I'll ask around
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 12:50PM
slides ->
Melissa Graham Wed 2020-08-12 12:52PM
May I post this link to the website for this plenary?
Melissa Graham Wed 2020-08-12 12:52PM
Or I can make a PDF and upload it.
Melissa Graham Wed 2020-08-12 01:12PM
@Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) I made a PDF and uploaded it.
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 01:27PM
Alison Rose Wed 2020-08-12 12:50PM
Technical issue with Zoom: the name IDs are out of sync with the speakers as of two speakers ago: the name below the current speakers on my screen is McGehee. are others seeing this?
Chris Walter Wed 2020-08-12 12:51PM
Looks OK to me.
Tom J Wilson Wed 2020-08-12 12:51PM
No I believe I see Tom as the speaker name and assume this is Tom speaking
Alison Rose Wed 2020-08-12 12:51PM
Thanks: will reboot
T Sloan Wed 2020-08-12 12:51PM
I have the same issue but after a few mins it catches up
Chris Walter Wed 2020-08-12 12:52PM
I would try just leaving and rejoinign the meeting.
Chris Walter Wed 2020-08-12 12:52PM
rebooting shouldn't be necessary.
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 12:52PM
at the bottom of the slide si the email of the speaker
Alison Rose Wed 2020-08-12 12:52PM
Thanks. Just caught up for me too. Tom Loredo? // Thanks Fed.
Peregrine Wed 2020-08-12 12:52PM
I am definitely not speaking now :slightly_smiling_face:
Alison Rose Wed 2020-08-12 12:53PM
I was guessing but wondering if Trillings parent's named them Peregrine :slightly_smiling_face:
Merlin Wed 2020-08-12 01:05PM
Falcon-named astronomy crew unite! :muscle:
Tom J Wilson Wed 2020-08-12 12:54PM
Q: What are your preferred interactions between the ISSC and others? How would you like to interact?
Tom Loredo Wed 2020-08-12 01:09PM
The Community forum (Statistics Q&A, in the Science category) and the Slack "Ask the ISSC" channel are good for public interactions. For private interactions, contact the chairs (currently Chad Schafer and me).
Tom J Wilson Wed 2020-08-12 12:55PM
(can I clarify that that's an ISSC page on )
Tom J Wilson Wed 2020-08-12 12:58PM
For posterity: I think this was answered as "yes" in the zoom Q&A chat as the "Statistics Q&A" category
K-T Lim Wed 2020-08-12 12:59PM
Tom Loredo Wed 2020-08-12 01:05PM
Yes, that's right-the Statistics Q&A forum. It's in the "Science" category; here's a direct link:
David Trilling Wed 2020-08-12 12:57PM
@Chuck Claver -- thanks for your question. i'm not sure to what degree meteor trail statistics will be available. is that written down anywhere? this is definitely a topic that people work on (though not me).
Dara Norman Wed 2020-08-12 12:58PM
I am interested in plans to connect with HBCUs and NSBP. (forget who mentioned) How are people thinking about making these contacts? Or do people already have contacts?? Even without funding there is work to be done making contacts.
brant Wed 2020-08-12 01:00PM
I am very willing to help here, thanks for raising this issue.
Alison Rose Wed 2020-08-12 01:02PM
Hi Dara! I would like to connect with you about this. I am dedicating my doc project to serve DEI. would love to tell you want I'm thinking and get your feedback and thoughts. Greetings to you. It's been a year.
Dara Norman Wed 2020-08-12 01:02PM
As a note the National Society of Black Physicists (NSBP) annual meeting will be virtual this year and so this is a good year to take a look.
Rstreet Wed 2020-08-12 01:02PM
I hope this is something that we can talk more about perhaps in Friday's session. I think a lot of people care about this. I'm keen to have a cross-SC effort here.
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 01:03PM
YES Dara! TVS has committed funds to have a booth (or equivalent) at NSBP
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 01:04PM
and is proposing a mentoriship program within HBCU minority service institutes to foundations
Dara Norman Wed 2020-08-12 01:05PM
@Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) let's talk about NSBP. I am co-chair of ASTRO. There may be some other good ways to be involved this year.
Chris Walter Wed 2020-08-12 01:06PM
Even having resources available to point to for such students would be really helpful. For example: We are working with a student at a local HBCU now. I could really use a few things like a list of bridge programs targeted towards astro.
Chris Walter Wed 2020-08-12 01:06PM
If we could centralize resources like that it would be quite helpful to find things.
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 01:07PM
Would a short video on Rubin and the SCs be helpful?
Dara Norman Wed 2020-08-12 01:08PM
@Alison Rose your picture was so small I didn't recognize you! This interest 'up front' interest in DEI is a big change from our previous discussions eh? Happy to talk more. Emailing me is better. (I am not often on Slack!)
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 01:08PM
and yes - I can work on centralizing high level resources for the SCs!
Dara Norman Wed 2020-08-12 01:11PM
@Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) NSBP format is likely to be such that a short video will probably be very useful for the meeting. We should talk more.
Chris Walter Wed 2020-08-12 01:13PM
Hi Fed, if that was to me I wasn't talking specifically about things related to the Rubin, SCs etc, but more towards resources to help students generally. I know and can explain about Rubin etc. [ but Maybe this was to the NSBP meeting?}

But, I don't have a lot of experience with things like bridge programs, programs these students can attend, other resources they might use etc. The students may have nothing to do with Rubin or, in the end, they might.

Maybe such lists already exist! I was getting ready to go out and try to find some so was just pointing out that having it be easy to find for people associated with Rubin would be a help for anyone trying to work with such students.

So the Rubin community could help to lead by filling this role for us an others too.
Dara Norman Wed 2020-08-12 01:15PM
@brant great! let's keep in touch on it!
brant Wed 2020-08-12 01:17PM
Will do @Dara Norman I'll send you an email. :)
Dara Norman Wed 2020-08-12 01:25PM
@Chris Walter hi we met last year (my 9 year old son plans to play basketball at Duke) I would be interested in helping get such information together as I have been thinking about developing 'toolkits' for better inclusive practice. I am interested in what other resources you think would be most helpful for you to have in mentoring of your students.
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 01:25PM
@Dara Norman lets! we can talk by email - we could also open a community topic?
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 01:25PM
@Ranpal (she/her/hers) also was thinking about HBCU+ and talking about it in the DEI slack
Dara Norman Wed 2020-08-12 01:27PM
@Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Argh! I just managed to use Slack and now you want me to use another platform! Yes I know that is most useful so I will try it out... but you are taxing my old brain!
Chris Walter Wed 2020-08-12 01:36PM
Hi @Dara Norman .. Ah, right! I remember meeting you and your son now in Tucson. I'll try to keep track of things I want to know and what I find for this and let you know later.
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 02:03PM
hah! ok, lets just keep it to email @Dara Norman
Dara Norman Wed 2020-08-12 03:37PM
Only for now... I should get more adept at Community!

Dara Norman
950 N. Cherry Ave_
Tucson, AZ 85719

Chuck Claver Wed 2020-08-12 01:00PM
@David Trilling This is why I asked the question - there is significant discussion about the suppression of long trails in the data due to the satellite contamination issues we will are likely to face. I should have said mitigation of long streaks not suppression.
Meg Schwamb Wed 2020-08-12 01:07PM
I think most of the SSSC is not using the data for meteor trails, but fast moving asteroids and near earth objects will be short streaks. A great person to talk about this would be @Mario Juric . I would say 95% of the SSSC is going to be using the detections that come out of the Rubin Solar System Processing pipelines
Meg Schwamb Wed 2020-08-12 01:09PM
As far as I know, no one is planning on searching the LSST images for very long streaks. that could get confused with satellite streaks
Robert Lupton Wed 2020-08-12 01:15PM
@Clare Saunders has been working on trail detection from the point of view of getting rid of them. She'd be a good project-side person to ask.
In general, I expect to characterize things we remove, or at least make it possible for you to do so
Lee Kelvin Wed 2020-08-12 01:02PM
David Trilling Wed 2020-08-12 01:02PM
@Chuck Claver ahh .. yes. would it be helpful to have a solar system expert on this topic be part of that conversation? (if you don't already have such a person)
Melissa Brucker (she/her) Wed 2020-08-12 01:05PM
Peter Brown is a preeminant meteor scientist.
Michele Bannister Thu 2020-08-13 04:40AM
There are a number of people we could check with for sure; Peter is definitely one of them, the Desert Fireball Network folks are another (for the Aussies)
Alison Rose Wed 2020-08-12 01:02PM
:clap: :clap: :clap:
Robert Blum Wed 2020-08-12 01:02PM
Michele Cantiello Wed 2020-08-12 01:02PM
brant Wed 2020-08-12 01:03PM
Thanks @Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) for raising /acknowledging many important issues. Thanks also to the speakers.
Tim Holt (He/Him) Wed 2020-08-12 01:03PM
:clap: :clap: :clap:
David Buckley Wed 2020-08-12 01:03PM
Thanks :+1:
Aprajita Verma Wed 2020-08-12 01:03PM
Pasting from Q&A: Luis Pineda 05:21 PM
It's possible to collaborate in SC, for people with not science formation background, like self-taught people, hackers, and other carrier backgrounds?
Aprajita Verma Wed 2020-08-12 01:04PM
Rachel Street 05:30 PM
Hi Luis, speaking for TVS we welcome people with a range of backgrounds - having a range of experience can be very beneficial
Aprajita Verma Wed 2020-08-12 01:10PM
@Luis Pineda same for SLSC!
Luis Pineda Wed 2020-08-12 01:19PM
Thank you very much :slightly_smiling_face:
Sara (Rosaria) Bonito Wed 2020-08-12 01:03PM
Luis Pineda Wed 2020-08-12 01:04PM
All of you are amazing, I love that you bring science close to people !!!!
this alone deserves a Nobel Prize
Chuck Claver Wed 2020-08-12 01:07PM
WISE Prize for education and Holberg Prize for social sciences :slightly_smiling_face:
Hiranya Peiris Wed 2020-08-12 01:04PM
Aprajita Verma Wed 2020-08-12 01:04PM
Pasting from Q&A: David Buckley 05:31 PM
How much cross-collaboration is there with TVS, e.g. on blazars?
Aprajita Verma Wed 2020-08-12 01:04PM
William Brandt 05:39 PM

We are certainly happy to work together with TVS and other SCs constructively, though there is not a formal arrangement presently. A few AGN SC folks have joint membership in TVS to keep communications good, and also I get TVS emails partly to ensure such appropriate collaboration. Hope this helps.
Aprajita Verma Wed 2020-08-12 01:04PM
Franz Bauer 05:42 PM

Specifically, at the moment, there is not much cross-collaboration due to resource limitations in both SCs. A few AGN SC members are also members of TVS, and the idea is that they can try to laiason between the two groups. There are classifiers being developed that will tag blazars as such, and a few AGN SC members are interested in the more detailed physics from variability.
More generally, AGN are embedded in galaxies, and are variable objects which, when luminous can be confused with stars. Ultimately, it would be ideal if there were an extensive network of cross-collaboration efforts among all of the SCs...but again...$$$ is essential so people can devote time to it.
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 01:22PM
indeed TVS has a quite active blazars subgroup and we plan on coordinating more closely with AGN but ^^^ the things that Franz mentioned are bottle necks
Hcabrera Wed 2020-08-12 01:04PM
Aprajita Verma Wed 2020-08-12 01:05PM
pasted from Q&A: Jeff Carlin 05:56 PM: Statistics Q&A is the category on that Fed was referring to.
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 01:21PM
thank you! and the #issc-ask-the-issc is the slack channel on the LSSTC slack
Massimo Dall'Ora Wed 2020-08-12 01:08PM
I have a general question, about the SCs. At the present time, non-US scientists (those whose institutions signed the previous agreement) do participate to SCs. Suppose that an institution will not pass the in-kind contribution selection, or only a smaller amount of PIs would be acknowledged. What would this imply for the participation to SCs? Is it a question for the next session? :slightly_smiling_face:
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 01:19PM
Certainly scientists with data rights will be allowed to apply to any SC, and at this time the PIs that were parts of existing MOUs are treated as data right holders until the end of the in-kind proposals process. The SCs are considering if it is feasible to extend membership to non-data-right holders from a technical perspective (i.e. how do you safely manage an environment where only some of the SC can see the data? what is the technical burden to implement it?) and will have a policy on it before oprations
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 01:20PM
if you are a member of an international community that is in the process of developing an in-kind proposal tho you can apply and we have an "observer" status which can be thought of as a provisional membership
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 01:20PM
(some SCs had specific words about their specific policy in the slides too)
Massimo Dall'Ora Wed 2020-08-12 01:20PM
thanks, Federica
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 01:27PM
@channel we do welcome more questions and we will continue to answer them! thank you for your attention!
brant Wed 2020-08-12 01:35PM
Regarding preparatory science support for the US community, @Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) your slides suggested that getting Rubin-focused preparatory science support has been challenging (colloquially and from personal experience, I believe that to be true via, e.g., NSF AAG). Has the Rubin project discussed a possible Rubin-focused NSF opportunity for preparatory science support with the NSF program officers? NSF Physics supported LIGO-focused research with a targeted program, and the desire for a similar Rubin-focused NSF Astro program has been discussed informally before (at least in some science collaborations).
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 01:39PM
that is something that we are discussing and considering indeed! I would say that the SC member do not unanimously think that that is the best solution, but certainly a fraction does. This would effectively limit the amount of $$ available, while no specific program in principle does not put a limit to the support.... but then if we cannot get the support what good does that do right? But the short answer is yes: we have discussed and thought about it
brant Wed 2020-08-12 01:40PM
Thank you, I appreciate the reply.
Robert Blum Wed 2020-08-12 01:56PM
@brant was the LIGO program preparatory or for research once LIGO was operating?
brant Wed 2020-08-12 02:07PM
@Robert Blum The LIGO-specific call (LIGO Research Support) has been archived, but it does support LIGO users during active operations with award start dates as early as 1996 (maybe before) and as late as 2020 through at least 2023.


I believe current awards are made through Physics IIR now, but someone else may know better.
brant Wed 2020-08-12 02:09PM
But I don't know what timeline for LIGO would be considered preparatory.
Jay Strader Wed 2020-08-12 02:12PM
One difference is the long-standing ways in which NSF Physics funds collaborations vs AST. So such funding was more in line which how NSF Physics was already doing things, but less culturally consistent with funding in AST
Robert Blum Wed 2020-08-12 02:13PM
before the first "science" run? With Rubin its easier. Certainly before any ComCam or LSSTCam data are available
brant Wed 2020-08-12 02:15PM
I agree @Jay Strader . Rubin is a new way of doing science for much of the community. That may motivate cultural changes in our funding strategy. Especially given that funding is available for some preparatory Rubin science through DOE currently.
brant Wed 2020-08-12 02:16PM
@Robert Blum The first LIGO science run ended in 2002.
Jay Strader Wed 2020-08-12 02:22PM
I agree that business as usual isn't going to succeed. I wonder if a broader program (e.g. prep science for MREFC programs) could be more defensible.
Federica Bianco (she/her/hers) Wed 2020-08-12 02:25PM
we did try grants outside of AST in fact! we met a possibly less encouraging response "this should certainly be funded.... but not by this program"
Matthew Graham Wed 2020-08-12 02:34PM
That's a response that has from within AST as well for some of the more methodological proposals
Tony Tyson Wed 2020-08-12 04:38PM
The NSB has discussed supporting some prep science activity as part of future MREFC projects, separate from NSF divisions.
Roger Davies Wed 2020-08-12 02:10PM
Well yes,
Ranpal (she/her/hers) Thu 2020-08-13 05:32AM
The recording of the live session is here: